Wednesdays Keep Coming Around...

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

But first... a question.
Considering the news we're hearing almost daily about men who are being accused of sexual harassment, it seems reasonable to ask ourselves about one of the two men we come here to read and write about.
Would Napoleon Solo be among those singled out as a predator?  Are his advances always welcomed by the women we see with him, or do some of them 'go along' with him simply because of who he is?
I wonder what y'all think, and what that looks like when we're writing MFU.
Okay, now it's on to...

Comments

[vmccooley.livejournal.com]

Unfortunately, a lot of 60s TV now comes across as borderline creepy/sexist. Napoleon's incessant flirting sometimes gets on my nerves, but I've never felt it was over the line.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

I agree that it reeks of the era, and perhaps more than that it reflects where that generation had come from as a post war generation. The social commentary could take weeks to explore.

[threecee.livejournal.com]

In general, Napoleon seems to stay within the bounds of (1960's) gentlemanly conduct.

There is the scene where Lisa Rogers is demonstrating the concealed weapons in her purse and says one spray for eliminating aggression has been used off-duty and gives Napoleon a meaningful glare.

In Her Master's Voice, Illya isn't behaving too well either, rolling around on the floor with a teenage girl and threatening to spank her.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

Re Lisa's purse, it is rather a nuanced statement about a woman's need to fend off aggressive, would-be lovers. Was that even a real product in 1967?

[threecee.livejournal.com]

As real as the communicator pens and UNCLE itself.

[jantojones.livejournal.com]

To my mind, there is a world of difference between persistence and harassment. While Napoleon's behaviour may seem sexist (and a little predatory) now, I still wouldn't see it as an issue. I also think of Napoleon as a true gentleman, and that he wouldn't never go where he knew he wasn't welcome.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

That's the key to it right there. Napoleon never forced himself on a woman who said 'no'. leethet references that in her comment.

[leethet.livejournal.com]

I think Napoleon was within the courteous standards of the day. He pushes just a little, sometimes, but he's never really over the line too much. I have to acknowledge, though, that if I didn't like him otherwise ... that scene in Off Broadway where he kisses Shari Lewis' character? That is a very sexy kiss, but one has to admit in cold blood that she was basically saying no.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

She did say no, and Napoleon's response is very realistic ;) I have to wonder now if he wasn't going someplace that made her refusal even more convincing on screen.

[hypatia-66.livejournal.com]

Thanks for an interesting question. Napoleon is very up-front about his sexuality - as Robert Vaughn himself seems to have been about rather similar behaviour. Though Napoleon doesn't seem to take advantage of anyone who doesn't want his attentions - it has to be said that, in the the context of the period, consent was assumed to follow when an attractive man made a pass at a girl ('girl' in 60s-speak) - it's a constant in romantic fiction.
But more important: he seems treat it as activity between equals, not boss and employee.

Illya's behaviour with Miki is a bit different, and a little unsettling whichever way you look at it. To be charitable, she is leading him on, and his response is to treat her like a child in order to defuse a dodgy situation. Beating a child is also dodgy, but better than engaging in under-age sex. But it looks like a close-run thing - at the end of the episode, she's obviously going to try again.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

Napoleon's pursuit of women is a well documented characteristic in the series, something that was originally intended, I assume, to reflect the James Bond spin. I suppose the willingness and at times aggressive pursuit of him can be credited to what was emerging in the 60's as the so-called sexual revolution. I don't think the women in film or television had, at the time, ever been quite as expressive in the area of love making (or what we assume became that).
As for Illya and Miki, I'll consider that the writers' nod to his overwhelming popularity to that segment of the viewership. That is was entirely inappropriate seems not to have been their issue in writing it,

[hypatia-66.livejournal.com]

Do you think the writers had second thoughts, afterwards? - the only other very young women who make advances to Illya are student age. The ambiguity of his response then wouldn't matter.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

The writers seem to have settled on the idea of Illya being sought after by young (very young) women. Nancy Sinatra was supposedly still a teenager, Miki not yet out of high school... I can't think of any others at the moment. The constant reference to his being 'cute' keeps him safely within that category of teen idol. Once in a while they would let him have something akin to a romance, as in the Birds and the Bees Affair.

[hypatia-66.livejournal.com]

Or only able to kiss the woman in question while safely trapped in the chastity belt of a prison cell - or off-stage, most obviously the flighty girl on the Adriatic Express (why else would she attempt to kiss him through the train window?).

[leethet.livejournal.com]

The idea of a little girl crush, I think, was still a pretty innocent seeming one back then - perhaps because no one thought for a minute the man in the situation would take advantage (there was, of course, much less transparency on sexual abuse back then - perhaps fewer men would have taken advantage in that era, but it's also true that some did, and it was hushed up).

Today we're not so innocent - something like that is perceived as terribly skeevy, and we expect the man to nip it in the bud and stay far away.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

The idea of a little girl crush, I think, was still a pretty innocent seeming one back then

Hopefully it still is, and it is obvious in Illya's response that he was indeed attempting to fend off her advances. The little tumble they take is for our benefit, to heighten the titillation effect, if you will, and keep that Kuryakin crush on its course.
Were they also playing to what has been reflected in some fiction, that he is much younger than the actor's true age?
At the end of the episode Miki's father gives them his blessing to go out clubbing together. Is that an entirely different conversation, or another aspect of the era?

[hypatia-66.livejournal.com]

The more I think about it, the more problematic that episode seems. Miki even says to Illya, while watching the passionate kiss on TV, "Why don't you ever kiss me like that?" What! When is he supposed to have tried? He does look a little surprised, however, so one has to hope it's a slip of that little minx's tongue.

Her father's permission to let her go clubbing with him is definitely weird - he doesn't look young enough to take her out, even if he does look trustworthy.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

The more I think about it, the more problematic that episode seems.
It is at once a very strange situation that our Russian has been placed in, and entirely the type of situation every single one of the girls/women watching the show would have relished. Perhaps that is the whole point of it, that the writers knew what to do with our seemingly puritanical Kuryakin in the wake of his popularity.
I don't know if you are familiar with the show Mad Men, originally shown on the AMC network here. It is set in the 60's, and in one episode a character, a young girl, is caught masturbating as she watches Illya in the Hong Kong Shilling Affair. This is one writer's response in an article in Vanity Fair...
"What was even more harshly cruel about the Sally’s shaming was that she was only responding naturally to the sight and plight of The Man of U.N.C.L.E.’s Illya Kuryakin. All the little girls loved Illya Kuryakin with his blonde bangs and black turtlenecks, and the older girls too. That’s how it was then--for a season or two, in adolescent hearts across America, Illya was the Fifth Beatle.]
Too bad she gets the name of the show wrong (The Man of UNCLE), and seems to not know the difference in spelling blond and blonde.

[hypatia-66.livejournal.com]

I'm quite glad to say I'm not familiar with Mad Men, though I think I've heard about that scene before.

[leethet.livejournal.com]

**But more important: he seems treat it as activity between equals, not boss and employee.**

I would agree. Napoleon likes women. He likes them sexually, and he has - clearly - absolutely no problem with seeing them as competent professionals and grown adults. Strange as it sounds, his behavior toward the female villains shows this even more than his behavior toward UNCLE female employees. He reacts to the female villains sexually sometimes, sure - but he treats them, otherwise, with all the respect/fear/determination he shows toward the male villains.

[threecee.livejournal.com]

The threatened spanking was acceptable for 60's TV. Sometimes adult women were spanked by men who thought the women were too uppity or willful. It was apparently considered funny.

[hypatia-66.livejournal.com]

Hilarious. Not. How did we put up with being so patronised and abused for so long?

If we hadn't, there wouldn't be quite so many chickens coming home to roost so publicly. We have tough libel laws in the UK which is the only reason abuse allegations are not made so easily here as in the US.

[franciskerst.livejournal.com]

He certainly might be seen as a sort of predator, in the good ole times ways, meaning behaving with enough confidence and personal charm and charisma not to fear many rebukes but with enough good manners and elegance to take them gracefully when they occured. Did he use his social superiority and professional authority to win the favors of his conquests? Probably not deliberately but that surely played a part in his success. For many (most?) women power is the best aphrrodisiac, so I guess none of them would have complained and he wouldn't have abused of it ... too much.

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

I didn't see your reply, sorry for the delay in responding.
Most certainly Solo exuded confidence and success, a magnet for women in an age when men were their pathway to a good life.